Future Vision Symposium

[M143-02] · سمو وزير الطاقة (HRH the Minister of Energy) · التوقيت 00:46:55 · Future Vision Symposium · 2024-04-29 · مشاهدة عند هذا التوقيت

Well, first of all, good everybody and I would like to congratulate Dr. Al-Jaser and his team for setting up this meeting, historic meeting, because it was within, as Dr. Al-Jaser was saying, it was within this building and this vicinity. I think the beginning of, or the starting up of the bank was announced here50 years ago. So, it's always good to be reminiscent of how this institution had came about the very crucial thing how much of deliverables this institution had? And how much support help this institution provided for the Islamic countries and those who benefit from the services of the bank, regardless what nation, what creed, what religion they follow. Now, and just a bit of a reminder, luckily, Naser you were there in Abu Dhabi, somewhere around the 12th of September, there was an event our friends and our brothers from the UAE hosted, it was almost like 5 days or six days, since I became a minister,

[M143-04] · سمو وزير الطاقة (HRH the Minister of Energy) · التوقيت 00:48:30 · Future Vision Symposium · 2024-04-29 · مشاهدة عند هذا التوقيت

And back in 2019 and we had a pavilion, a big one. You remember actually interviewed me, while we were walking, and the theme of The Pavilion was Saudi Arabia In Transition. So, I keep telling people that we are the claimant of that name, because we had to endure an unusual year, trying to fend off, with our colleagues from the UAE, of trying to bring sanity to this discussion, and as you have said, practical realism to the debate on the issue of How can we intertwine, and not to lose any sight of the Trilemma, as you have mentioned, because actually these things will have to go hand in hand. You cannot compromise economic growth, economic prosperity, you cannot compromise energy security for the benefit of attending to climate change. And adversely too, you cannot compromise attending to climate change with being too factious, and too selfish, not only selfish on what will happen to the world today, but may what may happen to the world in the future.

[M143-05] · سمو وزير الطاقة (HRH the Minister of Energy) · التوقيت 00:50:00 · Future Vision Symposium · 2024-04-29 · مشاهدة عند هذا التوقيت

Because actually I honestly believe that policy setters, not only they have a responsibility of attending to the well-being of the people as they are today, relevant to the governments of today, but also they have a moral duty to attend to their countries, with a view that they should bequeath and inherit the future generation with governments, with countries that still has the aspiration and the potential for growth and prosperity. And to be effective in attending to global issue, I'm glad you mentioned that the notion of global. Yes, the last three days. And by the way, if I appear in during the discussion, if I appear a bit delusional, or what have you, it's been quite a three days for me. I was brought back to Saudi Arabia on Saturday, late afternoon. And ever since then until today, I think I've had like 50 some meetings, attended five or six meetings, and sessions like this. So, if I crack up or do as one president in the US had done in the 80s, without many naming names, he was supposed to go to three different events, and he had the speeches in his pocket, and as he went first for his first meeting he pulled one of the speeches, and luckily, he had his wife next to him, so she nudged him by the elbow by saying to him in a very low volume, but it was captured by the microphone: "You're using the wrong speech for the wrong audience". So, I leave it there, but honestly I think the debate was, you know, it is very difficult for a country like Saudi Arabia or for that matter GCC Countries, or for that matter OPEC Countries or OPEC PLUS Countries to be an advocate of being pro climate, yet attending to, not to compromise our national endowments. We've had that thing ever since this whole thing started. Luckily, we were engaged into this endeavor, ever since it was in, ever since its inception. So, I'll take you back to Rio de Janeiro 1992, the problem of so many people on attending to Climate Change. I keep telling them I was there which is true. I was part of the Drafting Committee, so I need not to be lectured about the content of the UNFCC Agreement, or the other relevant agreements, including the Paris Agreement and the Paris Agreement had its own pillars had its own concepts which we all concurred and agreed to the problem is not the Paris Agreement. The problem is the inter, the funny interpretation of what is the Paris Agreement.

[M143-06] · سمو وزير الطاقة (HRH the Minister of Energy) · التوقيت 00:53:40 · Future Vision Symposium · 2024-04-29 · مشاهدة عند هذا التوقيت

I think I have to mention something that back in June 2021. You were a witness to that, you were participating that press conference. It was then when the IA issued The Net Zero Scenario. And that Net Zero scenario was developed for the purpose of that Glasgow Climate Change Meeting.

[M143-08] · سمو وزير الطاقة (HRH the Minister of Energy) · التوقيت 00:54:14 · Future Vision Symposium · 2024-04-29 · مشاهدة عند هذا التوقيت

Yeah, I was, I gave it the LA Land Scenario. And I'm so proud that I did say that because I was alone. I remember meeting people in a conference in St Petersburg, some of them are big without naming names. Big Serious CEOs, they all jumped and congratulated me for saying what I said, I said Okay. What about you? Are you going to speak up or not. But when people are so worried for the purpose of being politically correct that they are denying themselves, or being politically correct that they will not utter a word. I don't know what we call that, but this is the kind of extreme, if you could call it. And to that extent, people were calling me Oh! How daring you are ? But look at the debate as you have rightly said today there are people that talking about it in the open. There are constituencies, there are government, there are industry that are speaking up now, speaking up, this is not about forfeiting the real issue in Saudi Arabia. We truly believe that there is a climate change, our issue is not admitting that there is a climate change. Our issue is how can we attend to it fairly and squarely, taking into account national circumstances of countries and trying to bring the debate to completely different structure where we had it before; a top-bottom approach, now it has to be a bottom-up approach because if we are to be faithful to the issue of national circumstances, if we are to be faithful to the concept of nationally-determined using national path and ways and strategies. if we are to be faithful to the concept that Paris Agreement did mention, which is subject to national circumstances, and it has to take into account, take into account historical responsibility, if we apply all of the above then, the share, the fair share of responsibility will be divided in a completely different Arrangement.

[M143-09] · سمو وزير الطاقة (HRH the Minister of Energy) · التوقيت 00:56:55 · Future Vision Symposium · 2024-04-29 · مشاهدة عند هذا التوقيت

I'll give you a number, and I'm sorry for taking that much of a time. it's not our numbers, it's relevant acceptable institution. I saw a statistic last week, it gives an entire OPEC Countries a 4% historical responsibility on Co2 emissions, 4% the US, 24% the EU 16 China. I think 22. So, how on earth who would accept that we will assume an equal or similar responsibility, when we only had that 4% out of this 100%. And this is the very issue of How Why Climate Change negotiation has been suffering is this sense of inequality. However, I must admit that in Sharm El Sheikh, in Dubai, I think the setup is being reformed, realism has started to emerge. An as a result of that realism, the resetting of the debate is coming. And luckily, now it is politically correct to speak of, but look at what happened. This is not even 3 years, almost you know two months, it would be from the La Land think to now, look how people are converging now to a different thing.

[M143-11] · سمو وزير الطاقة (HRH the Minister of Energy) · التوقيت 00:58:34 · Future Vision Symposium · 2024-04-29 · مشاهدة عند هذا التوقيت

But this is not the end of it, because again, you know, we're at it, again.

[M143-13] · سمو وزير الطاقة (HRH the Minister of Energy) · التوقيت 00:58:43 · Future Vision Symposium · 2024-04-29 · مشاهدة عند هذا التوقيت

I think we need a needle that goes to more realism and practicality and sense of acceptance that there are things, that are daydreams, and there are things that can really happen. And based on that realism will further allow everybody to cooperate. I believe in the bottom approach. I even apply it in my institution that I manage, you cannot ask, and how hypocritical to be honest. Now, my problem is that I'm forthright, and so bear with me. It is so hypocritical. And I have the Indonesian Minister here next to me, how on Earth you ask Indonesia to forfeit its economy, its growth and responsibility, and the amount that the Indonesian government knows and admit that there is still in Indonesia a serious amount of energy poverty and a clean cooking issue to masses of people. How could you ask a country like Indonesia, a country like Nigeria, a country like Ghana, like Madagascar.

[M143-14] · سمو وزير الطاقة (HRH the Minister of Energy) · التوقيت 01:00:02 · Future Vision Symposium · 2024-04-29 · مشاهدة عند هذا التوقيت

And that's why we are signing with the Islamic Bank an agreement today. You know, I have a lady here. She can speak to you about what she saw with her team. And I'm so proud of that team, because most of them are Saudi females, and their visit first visit to Madagascar. They were hosted by the president, his wife and they really went and saw the community. And saw with their own eye how people in a daily struggle try to make ends meet which is basically cutting tree, setting fire on those trees. And this is not a practice of the Madagascar. It's a common practice everywhere in Africa. It's a common practice in so many places in Southeast Asia. But to make ends meet, people would cut trees which we're getting rid of sinks, in accordance to the climate change discussion, converting them set fire on them, converting them into charcoal, going to the market selling that charcoal, make money, buy their food and use some of that charcoal in cooking their food, and they're living in this so-called Bangalow's Heast, burning that charcoal by virtue of science, expose them to that amount of smoke that they have to inhale. So, it's a good cause of death and the number are astonishing, or at least sickness. This is the day-to-day of life people. now, the numbers we have on clean cooking is I think it's 2.2 in an event on the pre in the Middle East COP that we hosted in October. I did mention, I still want to mention it again here. I don't know what kind of survey that was made to come up with that 2.2 Billion. So my guess is that give it a 20 to 30% each way, but it's if it even 100 Million people. Why would you ask people in Madagascar to name to go into renewable, when they barely, don't have a mean to have an electricity, how could you equate those people, and I'm not condescending, but I'm just giving people a realism onto this debate that how could you get Indonesia to be a responsibility for climate change or for that matter Nigeria with all the things, the good things that they are trying to do to really reset their economy and improve their lot, when you are going to bill them by a heavy bill that it would take huge amount of resources that could have been used in different ways that enable them to serve and solve more serious problem for. And this is the kind of condescending top-bottom approach that is really has to be reset. It is being reset and will continue fighting for that reset to happen. We're not fighting to avoid attending to climate change. We're fighting to attend to climate change in a fair manner that would endure that remedy. I'm sorry for taking so much of your time.

[M143-16] · سمو وزير الطاقة (HRH the Minister of Energy) · التوقيت 01:20:02 · Future Vision Symposium · 2024-04-29 · مشاهدة عند هذا التوقيت

Well, for that question to answer, you should go to the Mufti, and he will. But it’s again all of this Nuance goes into the kind of, if I could call it, the Intellectual Dichotomy that people live, within a day-to-day basis. It's the agony, it's the, again, it is all emanating from a condescending culture. I keep mentioning it, yesterday I mentioned it in another event a year or two. I think I mentioned it is this so-called with all the respect to our friends from Egypt is for Pharaonic Concept which was mentioned in the Qur'an "I make you see what I see and I lead you to the right path". And this kind of condescending approach mimicking what I have mentioned yesterday. You know, it could be emanating from a some sort of a religion, a dogma which differentiate people between being a Believer, as I said I think two days ago, or an Nonbeliever. And if you are a Believer, you will go to Heaven. And if you are nonbeliever, you will go to Hell and you will be burned by unabated fossil fuel. This is the kind of attitude. However, it's been as you have rightly said, it's been resented, it's resentful, it's been challenged, and again it's been demeaning for people to be constantly pressured and cornered into having to either to accept, or you'll be challenged in some way or another.

[M143-18] · سمو وزير الطاقة (HRH the Minister of Energy) · التوقيت 01:22:49 · Future Vision Symposium · 2024-04-29 · مشاهدة عند هذا التوقيت

No, No.. No, I'm not acting that.

[M143-20] · سمو وزير الطاقة (HRH the Minister of Energy) · التوقيت 01:22:56 · Future Vision Symposium · 2024-04-29 · مشاهدة عند هذا التوقيت

But then, you're drafting me to borrow from Martin Luther King speeches: "I have got a dream". And what have you, so we're going to get there. No, I think it's a sensation that people are still believing that the old days have not gone, and pass. And the fact that you have African countries, Southeast Asian countries, Middle Eastern countries, all of the above Latin Americans countries are not truly conscious of what is good for them, and what is important for them, and their negotiating skills are limited and their technical competence is minute, and because of that one can put extra pressure here and there, and move people to what I would call pushing people to her mental approach. I lead and people follow, and I put what I keep calling it the Lollipops. And these lollipops are sufficient to keep. Some of it has happened unfortunately, and people get accustomed to that.

[M143-21] · سمو وزير الطاقة (HRH the Minister of Energy) · التوقيت 01:24:23 · Future Vision Symposium · 2024-04-29 · مشاهدة عند هذا التوقيت

And one of these things which I feel extremely sorry for is the very issue that people fought for 30 years, 32 years, 31 years. Ever since Rio de Janeiro Summit, the concept of loss and damage was recognized, and mostly African country put the fight over 31 years of having people to recognize that concept. It only happened once in Sharm El Sheikh, and luckily because it was hosted by Egypt, and because Egypt is part of North Africa, and part of Africa, so at the last minute they had to concede to bring a put together a language that says we will address it in the forthcoming COP. And you know what happened just before the beginning of COP28, all of a sudden to be honest discussed. It was agreed that there will be a fund that would be created for the amount of $ 600 Million. With all the respect to the World Bank to be managed by under chapter whatever they call it which is managed by the World Bank, which means associating it to that chapter or that arrangement, the bank will take 25% of that amount for management of the fund which leaves the whole thing to merely 450 Million. I remember people were talking about Billions. And I have yet to discover what happened that people all of a sudden come compromised this and ended up creating a fund for really nothing more than 450. Can anybody tell me what a $ 450 Million Fund will do, because it was to do with adaptation. How countries in all these regions would benefit from a $450 Million fund to enable them to adapt to climate change. I don't know. So, I have to say it also that there is deficiencies from our side, those the likeminded group, the African group, the Asian group for having to fend off for our own interest. And if you don't, you will be compromised, and you will be swallowed. And that's why I through this forum. I urge people to bond and work together, because clearly one of the things that we did when we first, you know, we were the first to get engaged on this climate change negotiation, and I had to this present time three of the people that had negotiated and been part of that negotiations are one of them is actually a current minister in the Saudi government. The very thing that they put in the fair early going is the principle that all decisions has to be done by consensus, is the savior of the day. And I have to be proud to say that it was Saudi Arabia that fought like hell to induce that language. We were the only people, more or less, attending this meeting viciously. It was held in Geneva in late 80s early 90s, and they would have this meeting continue 24 seven… 24 hours. So, we even had to bring more resources to ensure that somebody will be present, where you have something physical to say, I am representing Saudi Arabia, where if they come and start discussing things in a very funny issues he would be able to go and alert working people to come. But this is the kind of tactics that he used which is 34 days continuous negotiation. Had we not imposed that language, I don't know what would have happen.

[M143-23] · سمو وزير الطاقة (HRH the Minister of Energy) · التوقيت 01:41:51 · Future Vision Symposium · 2024-04-29 · مشاهدة عند هذا التوقيت

Well, can I just remind people of data that I forgot to mention. You know, you talked about production of oil and whatever. Do you know that we are second to, I think, Norway when it comes to Scope One; and Scope Two we're number Two, second to I think Norway, when it comes to Scope One and Scope Two on emissions. Do you know of CO2, we are also number Two, when it comes to Methane Emissions? I ask you why should we be lectured about reducing our emissions by the very countries that are their ranks are number 12 and 11 and Seven and Eight and Nine. Isn't that I sometimes go out of my way by say, you know, let's have a workshop and we will show you what we did. So, please do what we did. So, you don't talk to us about doing something that we've already done, where set your rank is very low. In fact, at the break-up, I did mention it before 60 Ministers and so many. And I think there is a record for that.

[M143-24] · سمو وزير الطاقة (HRH the Minister of Energy) · التوقيت 01:43:07 · Future Vision Symposium · 2024-04-29 · مشاهدة عند هذا التوقيت

Again that has been a topic for me what you have mentioned. Now, I would put it back somewhere in January 22, we had an event in KAPSARC, and I was interviewed by Daniel Jurgen, and there is a seven eight minutes I could send it to you Muhammad to your organizer, if they can share it exactly, precisely. I was alluding to what you have just mentioned in the context that there will be in transitioning, using the narrow band approach. You would have more and more in fight over resources, metals, minerals, all of the above that gets into the components of the new or renewable technology. I mean energy source, including the electrification, including, which means that slowly and surely you will have not only competition on minerals and mining and what have you, and already there is an established lead on that. You will compete, you see competition on the cars, the grids, the very all of the components that will get into this preferred transition by some. And eventually, you will see that a country like China had taken the lead and our is competitive to others, and this is the precepts of what you have just alluded to. And I actually said enumerating more of in the presence of what would be the challenge of the future.

[M143-25] · سمو وزير الطاقة (HRH the Minister of Energy) · التوقيت 01:45:18 · Future Vision Symposium · 2024-04-29 · مشاهدة عند هذا التوقيت

And I think, I remember ending that response to that question by Dan, I said if people were worried about cartels, and the evolution of OPEC as another new and improved cartel or OPEC PLUS, I don't think that they have seen the real cartel that yet to come. So, I think what you see now is the presetting of the concerning by others on how things will evolve. Unfortunately, the remedy is border taxes this and incentive, programs that are exclusive. So, Yes, I did mention in that intervention with Daniel that the word may go into Silos. Now, they're giving it a different name, a much more finer name. they, I think it is called fragmentation which is the same. Now, I ask you how much time effort was placed to bring about globalization. Yes, in the 80, it took a Reagan a Thatcher to bring about new and improved International Trade System? How much people fought to bring GATT, and what have you to a world, you know, WTO with its own disciplines and what have you, and what have you. So, to me, we may end up reversing back to what we have learned from as a tough lesson that silos and fragmentation bring trade wars. And eventually, they bring reduction and calamitous results to the world economy.